Conventional but unconventional- My k100 build

[jjs1234]

5 minutes is too soon for that fan to turn on. That's a good thing. Your relationship with the Acewell is beyond me. What is slightly unsettling is picturing you doing prolonged idling of that bike at this stage. No leaks? That's good. Get it roadworthy, registered and insured then put it motion around the neighborhood. That'll expose glitches without washing down the combustion chambers with fuel.

If you idle it for 15 minutes and have wired it correctly, in temps of 80º either the fan will come on, the temp gauge will light or the bearings will seize.

In the meantime, you can do this.

Hey Laitch,

So I tried what you had written in your post about the coolant relay. I've tested all three methods Kama for the fan and temp light.

I'm going to assume I tested everything correctly but my results show that nothing works. I would like to know where I should start troubleshooting.

Thanks

Edit: I am currently running through this Diagnostic page:

http://www.ibmwr.org/ktech/fan-diagnosis.shtml


Temp Probe test: 414 Ohms
(I ran it for a couple minutes before)

Fuse 6 was burned out. My research tells me its the FI/Temp sensor fuse? If so the bike still started...?

I dont have a temp sensor light. I just realized this. Ill have to order one. The acewell doesnt have a light for this.

Jumped Pin 15 to A2. The fan starts. Albeit I need to order a new one, it squeals a bit.

Tried jumping the temp sensor with a paperclip. The fan doesnt start. (was supposedly mentioned in clymers) Also it appears this circuit I think runs off of Fuse 6. I say this because when the fuse was removed, the bike started right up (when jumped). When I put a new fuse in with the temp sensor still jumped the bike will not start.

This is a little bit confusing.


On the IBMWR page it says that "touching a jumper wire to connectors 31 and A3 should turn on the over temp. warning light."  31= Ground. A3= Light. However on the Acewell the Light needs a + and not a - .

[rbm]

Am I correct in saying that the k100 coolant temp sensor is more like a switch? It doesn't actually relay temp to the Acewell?

To test could I short out the coolant sensor and it will turn on the fan?

The temperature sensor in the stand pipe is is an analog NTC resistor that responds to temperature changes.  However, the temp relay consumes that temperature information and does not make it available to any other circuit on the bike.  So, no, the output of the temp relay cannot be sent to your Acewell and displayed as a temperature on the display.  What it can do is send a on/off signal to a light that will illuminate when the water temperature is over 113 degrees Celsius.

Yes, to test you could short the temperature sensor to ground to test the fan operation.

On the early K100's, Fuse 6 is supplied power from the fuel injection relay.  It supplies power to the temperature relay and the in-tank fuel level sender (old style with electronics).  The engine may start with this fuse blown.

Not sure how you jumped the temp sensor based on what you wrote.  Do you mean to say that you jumped pin "E" of the relay to ground?  If so, this action simulates a grossly overheated engine (the resistance of the temp sensor would be very low when very hot).  If everything is operating properly, the temp relay should detect the hot temperature and engage, turning on both the fan and the overheat light on the dash (the one you are missing).

If your temp sensor in the stand pipe is defective, it could send a reading to the ECU that will confuse the ECU and prevent the engine from starting.  It is a protective mechanism in the programming of the ECU that will prevent damage to the engine if it thinks the engine is overheated.

[The Dude]

Inject a bit of oil into the bush bearing very close to the fan blades.This bearing is the source of standard fan seizure problems.

[jjs1234]

Tested the sensor Ohms again. From the sensor itself Pin 1 is 804 Ohms. And the other pin (since as I understand it one pin goes to the FI Computer and the other is the cooling relay) is 790 Ohms.

Ground and Pin E.... 672 Ohms...

Fan works, when jumped.


I feel like Im missing something.

If I ground pin E. Nothing. Of course the relay is removed...?

Maybe its just me, but am I supposed to do these tests with the relay in-place?

Edit: Tried Grounding Pin E With Relay in-place. Still fan does not turn on.
Edit 2: Adjusted readings from Ohms.
Edit 3: Whatever I keep Connecting and testing it keeps blowing fuse 6.

Im almost thinking I should just give it a ride and see if it turns on. After I replace the fuse.

[jjs1234]

Going to just install an override switch. Post here http://www.motobrick.com/index.php?topic=6702.0  No point in being dumb about it.

I'll see if I can find a switch that fits right above the coil packs.

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[rbm]

Tested the sensor Ohms again. From the sensor itself Pin 1 is 804 Ohms. And the other pin (since as I understand it one pin goes to the FI Computer and the other is the cooling relay) is 790 Ohms.

What is the temperature of the coolant when you made this measurement?

Ground and Pin E.... 672 Ohms...

This measurement means nothing because the relay is a complex electronic circuit and it's uncertain exactly what resistance you're measuring at that point in the circuit.

If there is 12V at Pin 9 from Fuse 6 and the fan does not operate when you ground Pin "E", then your temp relay is not functioning.  that might be why it's taking out Fuse 6.

[jjs1234]

Hmm I might have a bad one. I did open it up but didn't see anything burned but that doesn't really matter.

I'll order a new one sometime in the future, but for now the override works.  that's the only time the fan comes on is when the switch is on.



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[jjs1234]

And the temperature of the coolant, I honestly have no idea. I was watching the resistance increase as the bike cooled off though.

*************

I rode her today, it was pretty fun. I want to say I rode about 10 miles. I noticed that in 3rd gear the RPM needle would go sometimes all over the place above 3 or 4000 RPM. It was sort of floating and then it would return back to normal.

It didn't do this when it was at a standstill and I was revving the engine.

Also the rear shock is quite bouncy so I may either rebuild that one or get a new one.

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[The Dude]

Also the rear shock is quite bouncy so I may either rebuild that one or get a new one.
[/quote]
Yeh,I got one too.its a pogo stick(look'em up)get something else.

[jjs1234]

Curious for those that have a k1100 front end:

Where can I find LED lights that FIT in the holes next to the ignition switch (modded triple trees).

[Laitch]

Any of these work, jjs?

[jjs1234]

Thanks Laitch! I bought two. The holes are 20mm wide. We will see, one for 4L gas level and the other for coolant temp or 5th gear.

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[jjs1234]

So I got both lights installed. One is for the 4 L gas light and the other is for fifth gear.

However it seems I have an issue with the 4L warning light. It's on all the time and I'm not sure why. I filled up the tank all the way up to almost the top and it still comes on.

The only reason I can think of but I haven't researched it yet is that possibly the fuel sensor wires got reversed on the 4 pin connector on the bottom of the tank. I had to disconnect all four wires and make them longer since they started to crack in the very early stages of this build.

[jjs1234]

To clarify, the light comes on after 10-15 sec or so, after the ignition is on.

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[rbm]

The thread will help to explain the inner workings of the early fuel sender unit.

If you measure the resistance of the 4L thermistor while immersed in fuel, it should read around 600 ohms at room ambient temperature.  Take the measurement with the tank connector removed, and probe between the thermistor pin and ground pin (not frame ground) on the sender.   If you measure lower than this, there might be a problem with the thermistor inside the sensor.

The reason it takes 10-15 seconds for the light to illuminate on your dash is because this is the time delay built into the BEP's design to implement the anti-slosh feature.

[jjs1234]

These are the readings I got:

The picture is if you are facing the bottom of the tank connector.

[jjs1234]

These readings were taking if you're looking at the connector that plugs into the bottom of the tank.

[jjs1234]

Where should I look to if the ohms look correct?

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[rbm]

That's a question to ask Maru probably.  It seems that the Brotbox is being delivered a low resistance reading from the fuel sender even though the values you measured in isolation are correct.

[jjs1234]

He sent me this for future reference in-case someone else has this issue:

*************

"i know this issue... roundabout 3 of 100 people have this issue...

the resistance of your harness is outside of specs. this is not a big Problem and if you can soldering, you can fix it in 2 minutes.

i write a German manual for this, but you only need the Picture inside for soldering. you must set a bridge to configure the BEP constant to the old Fuel-sensor. Look the attachment and let me know, you can soldering it. if not, you can send it to me an i do it for you and send it back. This is free, not need money (only money to send to me, i send it back to you free)"

*************
A rough translation of the PDF attached:


In rare cases it may happen that my circuit can not detect clean , Which
Tank sensor is installed . A resistance measurement can be usually the thermistor from
Swimmers differ .
But it may be that the harness has an unusually great resistance , then
no longer does this detection and the circuit goes from a float .
One possibility would be replaced the wiring harness or maintaining contact of the plug in
Triangle ( from the tank to the main line ) .
But there is a second solution :
Through a solder bridge in the BEP automatic detection can switched off and on permament
« Old sensor " are switched . The picture above shows where the solder bridge must be set ( red
Border).
If your not trusts you, send me the BEP back and I Solder you a bridge .
This service is free ( including shipping ) .

[jjs1234]

Working on my bike today mostly working on the rear luggage case. I was wanting to ask Kama someone on this forum told me that the luggage piece in the rear Centre could fall off if some sort of rubber spacer or something like that was put in some place. It was over four months ago when they told me so I don't quite remember I'll take a picture though on the bottom.

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[Laitch]

Working on my bike today mostly working on the rear luggage case. I was wanting to ask Kama . . . 
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Is Kama the digital diety that Tapatalk users ask to put them in touch with forum members, jjs?

That the top case falls off is news to me. What usually happens is that the lid flips open after the bike hits a bump at speed and the box distributes its contents along the road. An hour later you discover that it's empty when you stop for refueling. Reinforcement of the latch, changing the latch to a different style or cinching the lid closed are the remedies.

[Martin]

Also the top box can commit suicide on bumps, the T pin  in the box disengages with the rack. The cure is to put some of that dense foam rubber between the box and the rack. You need to put enough so that you have to push the box down to engage the T pin.
Regards Martin.

[Laitch]

Also the top box can commit suicide on bumps, the T pin  in the box disengages with the rack. The cure is to put some of that dense foam rubber between the box and the rack. You need to put enough so that you have to push the box down to engage the T pin.
Regards Martin.

My box took out its despair on me rather than throwing itself on the road. Thanks for presenting the preventive solution for boxicide, Martin. Makes sense.

[The Dude]

Not the best BMW design.
A mate(my push starter) always has a couple of bungee loops over lid,box and all.