Author Topic: Overheating - time for a rebuild?  (Read 22905 times)

Offline Scott_

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #50 on: November 26, 2018, 06:14:25 PM »
If you are going to have the cam cover off and 1 cam out, I'd suggest you go ahead and pull both cams(1 at a time.....) and go ahead and check/measure your buckets, record them on paper, for your future reference.....save yourself some time and grief later on when you do the next check, but that's just me.
  • My Garage
1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
1997 K1100LT 0302488 (R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #51 on: November 26, 2018, 07:29:22 PM »
If you are going to have the cam cover off and 1 cam out, I'd suggest you go ahead and pull both cams(1 at a time.....) and go ahead and check/measure your buckets, record them on paper, for your future reference.....save yourself some time and grief later on when you do the next check, but that's just me.

Great idea!
  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline Filmcamera

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #52 on: November 26, 2018, 07:37:10 PM »
Sounds good, I will do that, I like the idea of taking the camshafts off one at a time as well!


I finished the second radiator flush process and buttoned everything up again.  A quick test ride was inconclusive but I did get all the way up my hill without the fan coming on until the very end, normally I turn the manual fan on as a matter of course at the bottom and the temp still hits auto fan on temps by the top so I would say that is an improvement.  I plan on leaving the manual fan switch alone for a few days to get a better feel for how hot it gets how quickly.


Thank you to everyone for all the help, believe me I will need more when it comes to taking the buckets out!!  yawl yawl


Until then time to go and get some miles in while she who must be obeyed is out of the country...


  • San Jose, Costa Rica
  • 1991 K100RS 16v ABS1, 2022 Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro
Poserbricker

Offline Filmcamera

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #53 on: November 27, 2018, 06:51:52 PM »
I went for a ride today to see how the bike was doing after all the radiator work and the new coolant.  I purposefully left the manual fan switch alone to see how it went.  the bike ran great, the fan only came on right at the end of the ride after a few minutes in a car park at sub 5 mph speeds.  It does seem though that the temp gauge is failing - the fan kicked in when the temp gauge was reading less than half way!  I could feel the bike was hotter than that from the brick tell tale toaster properties on my leg...


It is a matter of replacing the temp gauge or is there some maintenance I can do to it?


Apart from that the bike does seem to running a little cooler. Again the fan did not come on until right at the end on the way up my hill.
  • San Jose, Costa Rica
  • 1991 K100RS 16v ABS1, 2022 Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro
Poserbricker

Offline Martin

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #54 on: November 27, 2018, 08:46:20 PM »
What did you use to flush the cooling system clean water or did you use a flushing agent. The flushing agent needs to be compatible with alloy block. When you flushed it did you get any scale or muck in the water.
Regards Martin.
  • North Lakes Queensland Australia
  • 1992 K75s Hybrid, Lefaux, Vespa V twin.

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #55 on: November 27, 2018, 08:54:25 PM »
The temperature gauge and the sender work on a negative coefficient, that is, the higher the temperature the lower the sender resistance.  That your gauge is reading low leads me to suspect a dirty/bad connection somewhere.  You should go through the entire signal path from the sender to the gauge cleaning the connections. 

Check the resistance of the sender body to the main ground at the battery.  It should be very close to zero.
  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #56 on: November 27, 2018, 09:32:58 PM »
What did you use to flush the cooling system clean water or did you use a flushing agent. The flushing agent needs to be compatible with alloy block. When you flushed it did you get any scale or muck in the water.
Regards Martin.

Yes, you never mention what has come out when you cleaned the various parts of the system.  Did much come out of the fins?  How mucky was the flushing liquid when you drained it.  Did a lot of muck come out when you did the system flush after you cleaned the radiator?

While it's important to flush the block, overheating the coolant indicates that the problem is in heat REMOVAL ie, the radiator.  There are only two reasons why the heat is not being removed.  First, there is not enough coolant flow through the radiator.  This could be caused by blocked passages in the radiator, or a bad water pump that is not flowing enough, or there is too much flow in the bypass caused by a thermostat that is not sealing it off effectively.

Second, there is not enough heat transfer between the coolant and the air.  This is due to air blockage in the fins, or mineral coating in the coolant passages.

Since you have done a lot of cleaning, we can assume for now that heat transfer in the radiator from coolant to air is not the problem.  That leaves the coolant flow as the source of the overheating.  Let's also assume that the radiator passages are clear and not restricting flow.   That just leaves pump flow and the bypass as the remaining suspects.

You might want to pull the water pump cover to check the impeller and internal passages of the pump.  Beyond that, I have no ideas on how to test it.  Perhaps someone else can offer some suggestions.

I have worked on a lot of marine engines, many of which, especially older ones had raw water cooling with block bypasses to allow the engine to warm up faster while allowing flow to cool the exhaust.  I have seen a lot of old engines overheat because the bypass does not seal completely when the thermostat opens, allowing a lot of cooling water to not flow through the block.  My experience is that it doesn't take much bypass leakage to overheat an engine.

I can vaguely recall that there was a brick owner who had an overheating problem that I think was caused by the way the thermostat was installed in the thermostat housing.  I can't remember exactly, but it may have had something to do with how a gasket was installed.  Again, maybe someone more knowledgeable may be able to supply more detail.

  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline daveson

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #57 on: November 27, 2018, 10:54:21 PM »
Also some thermostats have a togglethingy  that goes through a hole.
The thermostat should be installed with the hole uppermost to allow any air bubbles to pass through.

Also if the bottom hose is too soft it could collapse from pump suction when accelerating.
It is easy to check, look at the hose under revs when it is hot, ideally the hose wouldn't pass through the crank cover.
  • Victoria, Australia
  • Current; '85 K100RT~100,000km; four other bricks. Past; Vulcan 1500, V Star 650, KLX 250(dirt bike) TT250(dirt bike)

Offline daveson

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #58 on: November 28, 2018, 05:29:27 AM »
Another easy check when the engine is cold does the fan spin easily when pushed with your finger.
  • Victoria, Australia
  • Current; '85 K100RT~100,000km; four other bricks. Past; Vulcan 1500, V Star 650, KLX 250(dirt bike) TT250(dirt bike)

Offline Scott_

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #59 on: November 28, 2018, 06:25:09 AM »
FC, also note that there are 2 temperature sensors at work here....
The sensor for the gauge is mounted at the bottom of the water pump, and the sensor for the fan and engine fuel control is mounted in the riser pipe behind the radiator, bolted to the top of the block.

Like was mentioned check the electrical connections, you may also want to remove each one and see how much scale is on them as well.
  • My Garage
1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
1997 K1100LT 0302488 (R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb

Offline Filmcamera

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Re: Overheating - time for a rebuild?
« Reply #60 on: December 04, 2018, 11:58:27 AM »
I went for a spirited 90 minute ride in the twisties on Sunday morning and am glad to report the fan never came on once except as I pulled to a stop at my house at the very end.  The temp gauge is still out of whack but I will clean up the sensor this week when I do a leak down test (the tester arrived on Saturday) and see if that helps.


Thanks for all the suggestions, the bike is definitely running cooler than it was.




  • San Jose, Costa Rica
  • 1991 K100RS 16v ABS1, 2022 Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro
Poserbricker

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