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Author Topic: Old Brake Lines  (Read 19709 times)

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Old Brake Lines
« on: April 25, 2018, 10:15:11 AM »
Was bleeding the brakes on Moby Brick Too because of one of the front calipers locking up.  As I was attempting to flush the fluid to pull the caliper I noticed a fine spray of fluid squirting onto the front of the engine(explaining the paint damage there).  I removed the line and found a clump of rubber scrap jammed in the banjo fitting at the caliper, blocking the flow.

Even after removing the clump, the line was still very restricted.  Probably due to a collapsed lining.  This is the second time I have found this garbage blocking a line on one of my bricks, not to mention the collapsed line.  I think this is the warning that I need to shitcan all the original lines on my bikes and replace them with braided stainless. 

I'm looking at close to $700 in Spiegler lines to do all of them, but I guess I'll have to bite the bullet for peace of mind when I'm doing 90mph on the interstate or honking through the twisties.

In the photo below, notice the shiny dot on the hose where the leak was.
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline Laitch

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2018, 10:23:40 AM »
Quote from: The Mighty Gryphon on April 25, 2018, 10:15:11 AM
I'm looking at close to $700 in Spiegler lines to do all of them, but I guess I'll have to bite the bullet for peace of mind when I'm doing 90mph on the interstate or honking through the twisties.
I thought trouble came from behind, Gryph. I'd be looking for more acceleration. :giggles

Chris Harris has a classic video of your bike's condition.

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  • Along the Ridley in Vermont.
  • 1995 K75 89,000 miles

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2018, 10:26:05 AM »
Laitch, it's a bitch to go faster when your calipers are locked up...

...and it totally F's up your MPG.
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline Laitch

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2018, 10:28:30 AM »
Quote from: The Mighty Gryphon on April 25, 2018, 10:26:05 AM
Laitch, it's a bitch to go faster when your calipers are locked up..
Ok. You need more power, not acceleration.  :yes
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  • Along the Ridley in Vermont.
  • 1995 K75 89,000 miles

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2018, 11:10:20 AM »
Just pulled the line on the other front caliper!!!
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline Chaos

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2018, 11:21:17 AM »
They must use the same rubber in brake lines as in monkey nuts and that crankcase vent S tube.  Too bad they didn't use radiator hose rubber, that damn stuff will be around after cockroaches inherit the earth.
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  • sw ohio
1987 K75S    VIN 0231
Original owner, Original litter
200,000 miles (plus or minus) and 5 paint jobs
sold 6/23
2023 Ural 2WD sidecar (BMW's bastard step child)

Offline alabrew

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2018, 11:46:27 AM »
Over at bmwlt.com, it has become standard to recommend everyone to change out their brake lines as there have been many reported failures. I suppose the servo brake system is harder on the lines?


One of the first jobs I did on the RS was to change out the lines to Spiegler's.
On the '85, I only changed out the fronts and used OEM as that was less than the full braided kit.
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  • Birmingham, Alabama
  • 1985 K100, 1991 K100RS
Also:
2005 K1200LT
1979 R65
200,000 miles on BMW motorcycles

Offline Laitch

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2018, 01:39:08 PM »
Quote from: Chaos on April 25, 2018, 11:21:17 AM
. . . that damn stuff will be around after cockroaches inherit the earth.
They haven't already?  :yow
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  • Along the Ridley in Vermont.
  • 1995 K75 89,000 miles

Offline Martin

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2018, 04:28:58 PM »
Gryph no need to spend mega dollars. My local automotive brake shop brake make lines to what ever length you want. The only trouble is I don't think he does coloured lines. He will do rubber as in OEM or stainless braid in black $50.00 t0 $70.00 approx per line dependant on length and fittings. They have been trained and certified in order to do them.  I tried a couple of local bike shops and they wanted heaps more for the same line and process. I also have a neighbor who has a mobile hose repair business and he also does brake lines to order. I dare say if you look around you should find someone local.
Regards Martin.
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  • North Lakes Queensland Australia
  • 1992 K75s Hybrid, Lefaux, Vespa V twin.

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2018, 04:49:18 PM »
Martin, I don't know why, but it's practically impossible to find someone around here who will make brake lines for motorcycles.  After a couple weeks of looking, I found one place that made lines for race cars that made a pair of lines for my RT.  The fittings on them were way too long, resulting in a very short flexible hose section that made them almost impossible to install.  I used them anyway, and they rub badly on the swing arm and rear shock because I can't route them properly.  Did I mention that they were $90 and weren't returnable?

The Spiegler lines are a bargain. 
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline Martin

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2018, 05:03:26 PM »
That's really weird Gryph, that finally we can get something done that you can't. When I replaced my rear master cylinder and had to replace my rear line. I was cheesed of with the prices quoted by a couple of bike shops, a mate rang a mate of his and pulled in a favour. I went down to the local automotive brake shop and he came out measured the line and checked the orientation of the fittings and made one up on the spot. Another mate of a mate came around and bought my spare Chinese master cylinder and he had one made up pretty quickly for a good price. Have you tried mobile services the guy across the road from me does virtually any sort of lines applicable to automotive use.
Good luck regards a puzzled Martin.
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  • North Lakes Queensland Australia
  • 1992 K75s Hybrid, Lefaux, Vespa V twin.

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2018, 05:14:16 PM »
I spent hours on the phone with people who make hoses and auto brake lines before I found the guys that made mine.  I suppose I could have gone out of town, but that would be a shot in the dark.

I did find a couple that made rubber lines like the OEM, for no real savings.
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline stokester

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2018, 05:34:24 PM »
Quote from: The Mighty Gryphon on April 25, 2018, 10:15:11 AM
I'm looking at close to $700 in Spiegler lines to do all of them, but I guess I'll have to bite the bullet for peace of mind when I'm doing 90mph on the interstate or honking through the twisties.
Yikes!


I just replaced the lines on my '93 K75S w/ABS for $174.95 which included an extra charge for the colors requested, from Spiegler.

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  • Yorktown Virginia
  • '94 K75S Dakar Yellow - '93 K75S Seiden Blau - '91 R100RT Bermuda Blue- '78 R100S Smoke Red

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2018, 05:55:37 PM »
I have three bikes to do, all with ABS at about $235 each from Sportbike Track Gear.  Didn't know I could go straight to Spiegler.
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline stokester

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2018, 08:18:08 PM »
Quote from: The Mighty Gryphon on April 25, 2018, 05:55:37 PM
I have three bikes to do, all with ABS at about $235 each from Sportbike Track Gear.  Didn't know I could go straight to Spiegler.
I won a 50% off a brake pad set coupon from Spiegler at the local BMW rally and when talking with them decided to upgrade the K75S brake lines.


Check out -> https://spieglerusa.com or give Brian a call @ 937-291-1735


They were great to deal with now carry CL (Carbone Lorraine) brake pads.
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  • Yorktown Virginia
  • '94 K75S Dakar Yellow - '93 K75S Seiden Blau - '91 R100RT Bermuda Blue- '78 R100S Smoke Red

Offline Martin

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2018, 03:30:54 AM »
Gryph I've got a Goodridge line on the front and the local line on the rear. And I cannot for the life of me see the reason why one is four times the price. I went out and took a couple of shots of the yellow peril, he's also got a 64 Caddy in satin black with a metal flake purple roof, known in my household as the Battle Star Galactica. It resides, thank god under a cover so hard to get shots of it.
Regards Martin.

* Daves Hydraulic Mobile 2.jpg (61.82 kB . 767x576 - viewed 771 times)
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  • North Lakes Queensland Australia
  • 1992 K75s Hybrid, Lefaux, Vespa V twin.

Offline Scott_

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2018, 07:16:48 AM »
Gryph, I have one word that may help to explain your problem finding people to make your brake hoses....... LIABILITY.... unfortunate but true here in the states people are filing lawsuits for anything and everything. If some hydraulic shops hand made brake hose fails and an accident is the result I'd just about guarantee there will be a lawsuit filed. Even if there are liability disclaimers...  Sad but true.
From the business perspective what is cheaper, high liability insurance premiums against lawsuits or limit what your business does to keep liability exposure at a minimum and premiums at a minimum.
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  • My Garage
1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
1997 K1100LT 0302488 (R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb

Offline bizzaro

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2018, 08:17:21 AM »
Gryphon, thanks for this. I have been wanting to upgrade my lines since I got my K.  Now I am convinced and will be saving my pennies to do it sooner than later!  I am guessing most bricks with original lines are in about the same shape as yours, :mbird
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  • Vermont
  • Current:1994 BMW K1100LT Previous: 1982 Yamaha virago 920,1973 Honda CB550,1976 Yamaha 650 Special
See Ya in the Twisties,
 Bizz

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #18 on: April 26, 2018, 09:18:32 AM »
Stokester, I went to the Spiegler site this morning.  A set of lines in black with Titanium fittings is $255!!!  Needless to say, I am suffering from serious sticker shock.  I have carefully checked the hoses on Moby Brick Too, and right now, the problems are isolated to the short lines at the calipers.  Since I can't purchase these two lines by themselves from Spiegler I will probably be going to BMW for OEM lines, which, for now, only cost $30 each.

Scott, you are right on target.  In my search for a local source of lines I talked to several shops that said they used to make them in the past, but no longer do.  While they didn't come right out and say it, I got the impression the reason was the liability.  Even if they aren't the target in a suit, I would guess that the cost of insurance to cover that part of the business could be prohibitive.

Martin, it could very well be that since Oz isn't as "developed" as the U.S. it doesn't have the highly advanced class of parasitic money sucking lawyers looking for a huge payday at the public's expense. 
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline bocutter Ed

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #19 on: April 26, 2018, 09:37:32 AM »
There's a shop in Scarborough (GTA) that makes bike lines. They occasionally put a K75 rear line on eBay for ~$29.95. I called them and they need measurements to make a set. Then I found a NOS set of Spiegler fronts ...
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  • Toronto, Canada
  • '61 Puch DS60 - '66 Puch 250 SGS - '87 BMW K75s

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #20 on: April 26, 2018, 09:53:17 AM »
Ed, do you have a business name, phone number and address?   I have all the lines off the bike now so they could be easy to copy.  Might be a good excuse to come up for F&C on the way back from Scarboroughstan.

It would also be important to see how they build their lines.  The ones I had made locally here had threaded fittings swaged onto the end of the hose, and then the banjo fittings were screwed onto them.  This resulted in a hose with a drastically shorter flexible section that made proper fitment on the bike impossible.  It would suck to spend the day driving up there and winding up with lines like I had made here.

It would be really sweet if I could find someone in Saint Catherines to build them.  Seems I've seen a shop along the QEW.  I need to do a search.
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline Laitch

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #21 on: April 26, 2018, 09:58:33 AM »
Quote from: The Mighty Gryphon on April 26, 2018, 09:18:32 AM
Martin, it could very well be that since Oz isn't as "developed" as the U.S. it doesn't have the highly advanced class of parasitic money sucking lawyers looking for a huge payday at the public's expense.
Right. :giggles
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  • Along the Ridley in Vermont.
  • 1995 K75 89,000 miles

Offline bizzaro

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #22 on: April 26, 2018, 10:01:51 AM »
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  • Vermont
  • Current:1994 BMW K1100LT Previous: 1982 Yamaha virago 920,1973 Honda CB550,1976 Yamaha 650 Special
See Ya in the Twisties,
 Bizz

Offline The Mighty Gryphon

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #23 on: April 26, 2018, 10:19:56 AM »
Bizz, right now I'm looking for lines for a K100RS 16V that has six lines.  The K75S, if I recall only has four, five tops, and they're different. 

Gonna be searching for a shop in Saint Catherines.  I'm thinking that with the agriculture and shipbuilding there, along with the steel mills down the road, I might just have a bit of luck.  There are tons of small industrial shops on the frontage roads along the QEW.  Gotta be one that can do brake lines.
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  • In my garage in Marilla, NY
  • '91K100RS White/Blue
Current:
'91 K100RS16V "Moby Brick Too"

Past:
'94 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
'92 K100RS16V "Moby Brick" (RIP, deceased in a vehicular assault)
'94 K75S Special Edition Dakar Yellow "Cheetos"
'89 K100RS Special Edition "Special Ed"

Offline bocutter Ed

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Re: Old Brake Lines
« Reply #24 on: April 26, 2018, 12:45:25 PM »
Quote from: The Mighty Gryphon on April 26, 2018, 09:53:17 AM
Ed, do you have a business name, phone number and address?   I have all the lines off the bike now so they could be easy to copy.  Might be a good excuse to come up for F&C on the way back from Scarboroughstan.
... more commonly known locally as Outer Scarberia. They are further from you than I. Anyway, I'm off to Newmarket for the euphemistic donut.  :lets-eat:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Stainless-Steel-Brake-Hose-Line-Lines-Hoses-REAR-BMW-K75-1985-86-87-88-89/123088235364?hash=item1ca8a16b64:g:RBoAAOSwH~ta2O7s&vxp=mtr

I think it was Apex Brakes http://www.apexbrakes.com , but I have a Rennsport Auto Parts http://www.rennsportautoparts.com in the phone. Wonder if they're the same. Anyway they showed in an old thread on GTAM http://www.gtamotorcycle.com/vbforum/showthread.php?132852-Apex-Stainless-Brake-Lines
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  • Toronto, Canada
  • '61 Puch DS60 - '66 Puch 250 SGS - '87 BMW K75s
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