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MOTOBRICK.COM => The MBdotCOM Community Center => Topic started by: jacksdad1963 on June 06, 2014, 08:13:15 PM
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Hi from rainy Manchester, England :riding:
Simple question for you guys outside of blighty....just how big is a gallon where you are!
Here, 1 gallon is 8 pints, or 4.54 litres. For standard petrol we pay around £1.31 litre or 5.94 per 8 pint gallon :mbird
Shell Optimax style higher octane/power stuff is around £1.50 litre....over 70% is tax...
What are you paying? Be interesting to see what prices I find: places like Dubai and UAE pay 12 pence litre!
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Four quarts to a gallon, about 3.8 liters. Been running about $3.50/gallon +- a nickel for low octane this spring. Not bad considering.
Don't know what high octane costs 'cause I never buy it.
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....just how big is a gallon where you are!
Simple answer: US gal is 4/5 Imperial gallon.
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In 1961 i was a petrol jockey for a while in London. low octane petrol cost 4/11 d for a gallon
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Can you guys post the price you pay?
I reckon most of Europe is similar to what we pay, or is it?
We are taxed to death here, then have to pay road fund licence aka 'tax disc' for every vehicle we own, plus they have to be insured even if not used: you have to declare the vehicle 'off the road' say over winter, and return any unused tax disc, then re-apply when you want to get back on the road!
Its a real PITA but is changing again in October, lets see what happens then....
And the roads are all fooked, every single one needs major repairs yet the councils say they have no money :nono
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Sounds like you are here is the continental U.S.
Road fund taxed quite a lot, yet roads are in crap condition and govmn't says 'not enough money'........
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Yet the politicians can award themselves an 11% pay rise while nurses and police officers are expected to be thankful for a 1% rise - the first in 3 or 4 years. No wonder there's no money!!
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Here in Capetown the price of petrol is R13.61 per litre for leaded and unleaded. now a US Dollar= 10.72 SA Rands and 1 Br Pound = 18 SA Rands.
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Capetown fuel works out to 76 pence per litre...almost half what we pay!
Do you have to pay tax/road fund on every vehicle you own, like we do?
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CDN$1.55/litre Shell 91
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Yes. We pay a fuel levy plus motor vehicle licence fee annually. Toll roads are now coming into the picture so that the gangsters who run the country can steal more money from the public
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Yes. We pay a fuel levy plus motor vehicle licence fee annually. Toll roads are now coming into the picture so that the gangsters who run the country can steal more money from the public
Sounds an awful lot like parts of Texas and Southern California. They're privatizing the roads we paid for with taxes.
In the San Francisco Bay area, I pay about $4.10 for brand name regular (for the cage), and about $4.30 for brand name premium for the bikes. A lot of the price difference is not tax, the oil companies just charge california more.
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Here in South Africa the price of fuel is controlled by govt. people living inland pay more because of pipeline charges. As i mentioned in a previous post A supermarket group tried to get in on the act with discounted prices. They were shown the door very quickly.Also the petrol is very clean. Caltex use an additive in their product__ Chevron.
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We are taxed to death here, then have to pay road fund licence aka 'tax disc' for every vehicle we own, plus they have to be insured even if not used: you have to declare the vehicle 'off the road' say over winter, and return any unused tax disc, then re-apply when you want to get back on the road!
Its a real PITA but is changing again in October, lets see what happens then....
It's not 'road fund licence' anymore - that is now an incorrect term as since 1936 it wasn't intended to pay for the roads. It's 'vehicle excise duty' nowadays. Whichever way you slice it, it's a tax.
The 'continuous insurance' thing is also widely misunderstood - you only have to keep the vehicle insured if it's parked on the road, or it's taxed. If it's SORNed you don't need insurance (if it's SORNed it shouldn't be parked on the road either).
As for the changes in October, all that's happening is they are stopping the paper tax discs (so no more looking for somewhere to bolt a holder and no more disc thefts) and introducing payment by monthly direct debit for a 5% annual surcharge. That's it.
What you need to do is choose vehicles carefully - my 1972 land rover is free to tax and it costs me £63/year to insure comprehensive for my business :2thumbup:
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Sounds an awful lot like parts of Texas and Southern California..... :bang-head:
In the San Francisco Bay area, I pay about $4.10 for brand name regular (for the cage), and about $4.30 for brand name premium for the bikes. A lot of the price difference is not tax, the oil companies just charge california more.
Look to your surrounding counties that have different sales tax rates and you'll see the difference in the price of a gallon of gas.
I live in Riverside County and the gyppo gas is $3.85-$3.95/gal for regular (last nite anyway).....go north 25+ miles into LA County and it's (at least) a nickel more - all sales tax, as Riverside is less than LA County and certain cities within the LA County area have an even higher tax rate :yow
(and don't buy near a freeway on/off-ramp...drive at least 3 signals away for a significant price drop :yes)
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pdg, you forget to mention:
When you buy a used vehicle, the tax does not come with it, you have to tax it yourself, from the start of the month. The fact that the seller will have paid up until the end of the month means that every time a sale goes through the Gov will get a double payment.
If I sell a car now with tax on it, it goes with the car, so I can add this amount to the car value, whereas under the new system the seller and the buyer will lose out!
Are the Gov going to refund the seller for any unused tax, say I had 6 months tax on the car when I sell it? IF they are going to issue refunds, their workload will increase, the system will be much more complicated, not simpler!
I am a motor trader, I buy and sell several vehicles a week, and this new system is going to be a monumental cock up :nono
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Yes, 'unused' tax will be refunded in much the same fashion as it can be now.
In fact, there are 'plans' to make it so you can have part months refunded too, as well as start the new tax period part way through the month - thereby getting rid of that 'double payment'.
I used to be in the motor trade as well (I have had so many jobs....) and I see it as a much simpler way of doing things. Buy (or take in trade) second hand car without tax (because no choice) - whack on your trade plates to move it around, then sell it and new buyer taxes online on their phone at point of sale. So much easier than having to keep track of paper discs and expiry dates on each vehicle - no more thinking "well I've 'lost' money on that tax disc because that car has taken 5 weeks to sell, maybe I should have got a refund when I got it". The only traders who would be at a disadvantage are the ones who leave all their stock randomly distributed on the streets near their house and/or the ones who don't actually have valid MT insurance.
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Well thats good news: how did you find out about getting part month refunds?
Can you send me a link please :2thumbup:
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Sorry, I don't have a link - I did a fair bit of reading on it when I heard about it first and committed the 'important' parts to memory!
To be fair, how much turns out to actually happen remains to be seen - but given the way the system will be set up (monthly payments, non-transferable etc.) it would cause a bit of hassle for them to not include such a facility seeing how easy it would be to implement it.
I'm quite sure they'll manage to mess it up quite well in the first few months though....
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I'm sure there will be no refunds....thats why the Gov have been very quiet on the subject, keeping schtum as long as possible.
Issuing licence on a car and then refunding licence on the same car, but to a different person....for the same time period...won't happen!
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In Texas, a gallon is about 1/10 of this hat.
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Issuing licence on a car and then refunding licence on the same car, but to a different person....for the same time period...won't happen!
I recall the refund only being issued to the same person, not to a different person. So from a trader's perspective they'll get a car with no tax, keep a car with no tax, then sell a car with no tax. The original private seller gets refund of any 'unused' tax (if they apply for it, either online or at post office) and the new private buyer taxes their 'new' car. That's as I understand it anyway and I'm fully prepared to be proved wrong!
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I meant that the original owner (not a trader) will apply for a refund, at the same time the buyer will apply to buy, hence my concerns that the workload will be greater.
I always say that the duty should be added to fuel: those who use the roads most pay most, and those with green cars save money by not wasting fuel....but thats too simple for our Gov! :hehehe
How does it work in other lands?
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They get us on both ends of the spectrum here.
It may vary from state to state, but here in Iowa, you pay a registration renewal tag "fee"(i call it a tax) every year, plus fed,state,local taxes on the fuel you put in it.
Some states also have annual "inspection" fees that they pay, plus fuel taxes....
Farmers(here in Iowa anyway) can apply for a fuel tax exemption for fuel purchased for the tractors on the farm. Side note.... this "tax exempted" farm off road use fuel is dyed a special color(I'm thinking Red) so you better not get caught with it in your on road vehicle........
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The whole point of the 'new' system is that there is no workload - it's all computerised... You're not going to give it a headache by one person requesting a refund and then another buying new tax... In fact, for quite some time now the only people involved in vehicle taxation has been the owner and the woman at the post office with her stamp - even buying it online direct has been automated, hence the printed discs.
And yes, we have red diesel here too with no road duty paid - I use it in my chipper and generator. There's no application involved, just buy it in certain places and don't use it in a road vehicle.
Adding car tax to fuel is a silly idea as I've thought for years - if it was even pretended that the money was used for roads then just possibly, but it isn't...
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I don't use Red in my Isuzu Trooper 4x4, 3.0 turbo diesel....used veg oil is much nicer! :2thumbup:
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Yes. We pay a fuel levy plus motor vehicle licence fee annually. Toll roads are now coming into the picture so that the gangsters who run the country can steal more money from the public
Sounds an awful lot like parts of Texas and Southern California. They're privatizing the roads we paid for with taxes.
In the San Francisco Bay area, I pay about $4.10 for brand name regular (for the cage), and about $4.30 for brand name premium for the bikes. A lot of the price difference is not tax, the oil companies just charge california more.
Nope. It's a combination of taxes and required by CA fuel mix. CA has the second highest State fuel tax in the nation only surpassed by NY. That's on top of the federal tax in the fuel of about 20 cents. So Ca has about 70 cents a gallon in taxes
Here is fuel tax by state. http://taxfoundation.org/article/state-gasoline-tax-rates-2009-2013 (http://taxfoundation.org/article/state-gasoline-tax-rates-2009-2013)
Edit: another interesting link.
http://www.api.org/oil-and-natural-gas-overview/industry-economics/fuel-taxes (http://www.api.org/oil-and-natural-gas-overview/industry-economics/fuel-taxes)
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Fuel is at $4.15 per gallon here in Northern California Wine Country as of today. It will drop a few pennies after the 4th of July has passed.
They claim it is due to the high cost of transportation, but I find that hard to believe because the refinery is less than 35 minutes away. My daughter is at a college about 150 miles away and fuel is 25-30 cents less per gallon.
Greed and taxes. That is why my fuel cost so much. Just greed and taxes.
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Am I right in saying that a US gallon is 6.66 Imperial Pints?
Obvious number to stick in the mind....of course a UK gallon is 8 pints or 4.54 litres. Yesterday I paid £1.325 per litre for standard petrol :blackcloud:
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Fuel is at $4.15 per gallon here in Northern California Wine Country as of today. It will drop a few pennies after the 4th of July has passed.
They claim it is due to the high cost of transportation, but I find that hard to believe because the refinery is less than 35 minutes away. My daughter is at a college about 150 miles away and fuel is 25-30 cents less per gallon.
Greed and taxes. That is why my fuel cost so much. Just greed and taxes.
Greed?
If you made a widget and it cost you 50cents to manufacture it, 25 cents to get it to market and marketing and you sold it for $1.00. That would make you 25 cents for each one you sell. Would you call that greedy after the work you put into it?
Thats a 25% profit margin btw.
Is that reasonable for all the effort you put into it?
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UK gallon is 8 pints or 4.54 litres.
US pint is smaller, 16 oz vs 20 oz.
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Lucky Brits...they get more beer!
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Fuel is at $4.15 per gallon here in Northern California Wine Country as of today. It will drop a few pennies after the 4th of July has passed.
They claim it is due to the high cost of transportation, but I find that hard to believe because the refinery is less than 35 minutes away. My daughter is at a college about 150 miles away and fuel is 25-30 cents less per gallon.
Greed and taxes. That is why my fuel cost so much. Just greed and taxes.
Greed?
If you made a widget and it cost you 50cents to manufacture it, 25 cents to get it to market and marketing and you sold it for $1.00. That would make you 25 cents for each one you sell. Would you call that greedy after the work you put into it?
Thats a 25% profit margin btw.
Is that reasonable for all the effort you put into it?
I don't have a problem with someone making a profit. However, when they jack up fuel prices and then claim it is the high cost of getting it to market and yet fuel is cheaper 150-200 miles away from the refinery than it is only 25 miles away, then yes, i can't help but question if greed is involved.
Our dealers here in town will jack up the prices on Friday afternoon and lower them on Monday morning just to make extra money off of the weekend tourist. They also raised prices here a couple of years ago when they had problems with the oil platforms in the Gulf of Mexico. They claimed it was the cost of getting the fuel to market. Then they claimed it was because of the storms in the Gulf. It is my understanding that the special California blend fuel for Nor Cal does not even come from the Gulf.
Also, last time I heard anything about OPEC, they were running at 40 percent production to keep the per barrel cost high.
I can drive to the next city away, I have three to choose from, 15 miles east, west or south (towards the refineries, BTW) and find fuel for 15 cents less per gal. I doubt if the cost difference is that much.
Now maybe these things are sound business practices. I am sure they are all legal. I just question if they are ethical.
If I have to pay higher prices for fuel because there is a problem, I can deal with that. Just don't deceive or mislead me with false reasons and answers for the increases.
BTW, How much does it cost to fill up your K bike in your neck of the woods?
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Fuel is at $4.15 per gallon here in Northern California Wine Country as of today. It will drop a few pennies after the 4th of July has passed.
They claim it is due to the high cost of transportation, but I find that hard to believe because the refinery is less than 35 minutes away. My daughter is at a college about 150 miles away and fuel is 25-30 cents less per gallon.
Greed and taxes. That is why my fuel cost so much. Just greed and taxes.
Greed?
If you made a widget and it cost you 50cents to manufacture it, 25 cents to get it to market and marketing and you sold it for $1.00. That would make you 25 cents for each one you sell. Would you call that greedy after the work you put into it?
Thats a 25% profit margin btw.
Is that reasonable for all the effort you put into it?
I don't have a problem with someone making a profit. However, when they jack up fuel prices and then claim it is the high cost of getting it to market and yet fuel is cheaper 150-200 miles away from the refinery than it is only 25 miles away, then yes, i can't help but question if greed is involved.
Our dealers here in town will jack up the prices on Friday afternoon and lower them on Monday morning just to make extra money off of the weekend tourist. They also raised prices here a couple of years ago when they had problems with the oil platforms in the Gulf of Mexico. They claimed it was the cost of getting the fuel to market. Then they claimed it was because of the storms in the Gulf. It is my understanding that the special California blend fuel for Nor Cal does not even come from the Gulf.
Also, last time I heard anything about OPEC, they were running at 40 percent production to keep the per barrel cost high.
I can drive to the next city away, I have three to choose from, 15 miles east, west or south (towards the refineries, BTW) and find fuel for 15 cents less per gal. I doubt if the cost difference is that much.
Now maybe these things are sound business practices. I am sure they are all legal. I just question if they are ethical.
If I have to pay higher prices for fuel because there is a problem, I can deal with that. Just don't deceive or mislead me with false reasons and answers for the increases.
BTW, How much does it cost to fill up your K bike in your neck of the woods?
I can't speak for gouging on delivery but the point it makes it on the truck at the the refiner the company (BP,Texico ect)make 2.3 cents a gallon. The local gas station makes about 3cents a gallon. As their profits. Being diesel is extremely pricy in CA I can see the delivery charge being up there. I hear diesel is $4.90 out there. It's $4.10 around around me north of Atlanta.
Now another thing to consider is the mix. Depending where you are some location madate blends to reduce pollutants (never mind the fact it also reduces the fuel economy). You cost may be up for that reason as well. Summer gas here costs more then winter gas and I gain about 1mpg with winter blend in my truck.
As for gas cost near Atlanta. I pumped super today at chevron for 4.02 today into the bike (seems to run better and get a little better MPG). Regular is 3.60ish not counting the Kroger discount I got of 20cents a gallon that I feed my fat Land Cruiser. That about 20 miles north of down town Atlanta.
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Fuel is at $4.15 per gallon here in Northern California Wine Country as of today. It will drop a few pennies after the 4th of July has passed.
They claim it is due to the high cost of transportation, but I find that hard to believe because the refinery is less than 35 minutes away. My daughter is at a college about 150 miles away and fuel is 25-30 cents less per gallon.
Greed and taxes. That is why my fuel cost so much. Just greed and taxes.
Greed?
If you made a widget and it cost you 50cents to manufacture it, 25 cents to get it to market and marketing and you sold it for $1.00. That would make you 25 cents for each one you sell. Would you call that greedy after the work you put into it?
Thats a 25% profit margin btw.
Is that reasonable for all the effort you put into it?
I don't have a problem with someone making a profit. However, when they jack up fuel prices and then claim it is the high cost of getting it to market and yet fuel is cheaper 150-200 miles away from the refinery than it is only 25 miles away, then yes, i can't help but question if greed is involved.
Our dealers here in town will jack up the prices on Friday afternoon and lower them on Monday morning just to make extra money off of the weekend tourist. They also raised prices here a couple of years ago when they had problems with the oil platforms in the Gulf of Mexico. They claimed it was the cost of getting the fuel to market. Then they claimed it was because of the storms in the Gulf. It is my understanding that the special California blend fuel for Nor Cal does not even come from the Gulf.
Also, last time I heard anything about OPEC, they were running at 40 percent production to keep the per barrel cost high.
I can drive to the next city away, I have three to choose from, 15 miles east, west or south (towards the refineries, BTW) and find fuel for 15 cents less per gal. I doubt if the cost difference is that much.
Now maybe these things are sound business practices. I am sure they are all legal. I just question if they are ethical.
If I have to pay higher prices for fuel because there is a problem, I can deal with that. Just don't deceive or mislead me with false reasons and answers for the increases.
BTW, How much does it cost to fill up your K bike in your neck of the woods?
I can't speak for gouging on delivery but the point it makes it on the truck at the the refiner the company (BP,Texico ect)make 2.3 cents a gallon. The local gas station makes about 3cents a gallon. As their profits. Being diesel is extremely pricy in CA I can see the delivery charge being up there. I hear diesel is $4.90 out there. It's $4.10 around around me north of Atlanta.
Now another thing to consider is the mix. Depending where you are some location madate blends to reduce pollutants (never mind the fact it also reduces the fuel economy). You cost may be up for that reason as well. Summer gas here costs more then winter gas and I gain about 1mpg with winter blend in my truck.
As for gas cost near Atlanta. I pumped super today at chevron for 4.02 today into the bike (seems to run better and get a little better MPG). Regular is 3.60ish not counting the Kroger discount I got of 20cents a gallon that I feed my fat Land Cruiser. That about 20 miles north of down town Atlanta.
Now that the 4th of July has passed, Regular fuel is 4.09 per gallon, FWIW. That's about 50 cents per gallon more than what you pay. Some areas in town it is priced even more.
We have the mandated special blended fuel you speak of, and you are correct about poor mpg. The bike also does not perform like it does on "real" gas. Personally, I think it is a sham for us to buy more fuel. Has anyone ever done studies about the pollution levels considering that we have poorer fuel economy.
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Working on todays exchange rate $1 = £0.58
US Gallon is 6.66 pints
UK Gallon is 8 pints
We pay 77p per pint You Pay 35p per pint :nono
Our Gov rip us off, as most of the price difference is tax, yet about NONE of it is spent on road maintenance!