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TECHNICAL MOTOBRICK WRENCHING In Remembrance of Inge K. => Project Custom Motobricks => Topic started by: gavthirtyseven on October 11, 2012, 03:20:15 AM
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Hi all, new here on Motobrick, and new to BMW ownership as well. In fact so new all I currently own is a rear wheel!
I'm about to get underway on a k100 race bike project for BEARS (Brit, Euro, American, Race Series) racing in New Zealand. I'm aiming to start with a 16v paralever rear end k100rs, mainly due to the inreased power over the 8v model.
Parts collecting has started with a 17 x 5 inch rearwheel from a late model R series, and I think a RAM rear shock will soon be making its way to me, and some stiffer fork springs.
I suppose I'll have a few thousand issues to solve along the way, but the plan is to leave the motor pretty standard and remove as much as possible from the bike and fit some clip on bars, rear sets, modern race tyres (hence the new wheel!), and fibreglass single seat unit.
As part of this process I'll junk the standard clocks and replace with single tacho and engine temp sensor.
Has anyone any idea on what tacho I could fit from any other bike? I guess the K100 has an electronic sensor as opposed to a cable/gear arrangement from the gearbox?
Not looking to break the bank on this project so a tacho from another bike off ebay should be cheaper than a specific race unit from Koso, vapor, etc. And I can get searching on ebay now for one.
Do the later K100rs bikes have a temp guage (water) or just a warning light? What temp does that light kick in at?
Any other ideas, hints and tips welcome.
Just need to get a bike now :embarass:
Thanks BMW dudes!
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Hello, sounds a great idea! Have you had a look at www.oldracer.co.uk (http://www.oldracer.co.uk), they've competed a k100 at the B.E.A.R.S series. I don't know if its of any use but I used a www.trailtech.net (http://www.trailtech.net) speedo for my offroad bike and it was very easy to fit and didn't rely on any standard pre-installed pickups. The website has all the user manuals etc. Make sure you keep us updated!
Good luck
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You may get some interesting info here www.bskspeedworks.co.uk (http://www.bskspeedworks.co.uk)
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Yes that BSK speedworks / old racer bike is really the inspiration for my build. Cool bike :drool:
I like the air intake idea next to the radiator...might have to do the same. cool shades
The standard 16v k100rs quoted power and torque figures should make a good race bike if enough weight can be removed and the handling/tyres improved... well if not it'll look pretty :lol:
I'm hoping to avoid the costs of cams and complete new ecu and wiring of the BSK bike.
I also have a great write up in an old Classic racer magazine of the jj Cobas K-brick bike as well for even more inspiration... :2thumbup:
As for the trail tech unit - Yes I've seen a few other units like that but was hoping to get a real 'moving needle' display for the tacho as they are a bit clearer to see when racing.
Thanks for the input so far...
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I scored a set of 1200 cams and want to try them in the K1100. I am not even sure they are different but I got them for nothin so worth a go and the other thing is some port work and 1200 throttle bodies to make them breath then this and then that then more of it and on it goes. I seem to remember doing that to a Z900 till I ended up with a blown alcohol bike running mid 8s in 1980. Thats probably why I havent got any money now, but it was fun.
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Yes, I'd like to keep away from the engine as much as possible, just removing stuff not adding - yet! :hmm:
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A few more weeks have passed, and the parts collecting is coming on well...
As well as the 17 x 5 wheel, Ive added:-
Race sigle seat unit (Z-But !?) looked cool on ebay, and very similar to the Old Bike Bears bike, and a small nose cone usually used on a honda hornet race bike,
Tomaselli quick action throttle,
SV650 clip ons, with 0.7mm removed on the lathe should be a perfect fit
2 new(ish) front discs
and finally - most importantly - a bike! Yay! a 91 k100rs 16v. Yipee! :lol:
Was looking all over NZ and France and the UK for a suitable (err - cheap!) scruffy bike to turn into a race bike and one shows up in NZ only 5km from where I live :2thumbup: Except I'm in France at the moment til January working :hmm: :confused:
Thankfully a friend has been and checked it out, talked him down a few $$ and it now sits in his garage :k75s :yes
Just in the process of getting a shock sorted and wondered if anyone here has fitted a longer that standard (380mm) shock to the rear of the Paralever equiped bikes? K1, 100, 1100?
Can either get a Progressive suspension built up with a ride height adjuster, or a RAM suspension unit with a standard, plus a 15mm longer top mounting... Still pondering... :hmm:
Anyway, we're getting there, and I need to remember that old Russian saying about slowing down "Remember 9 pregnant ladies do not make a baby in 1 month!" :loco:
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Good luck and keep in touch, i may be able to save you a few hundred hours/$ of trial and error...
Ben,
www.bskspeedworks.co.uk (http://www.bskspeedworks.co.uk)
www.oldracer.co.uk (http://www.oldracer.co.uk)
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Just another quick update...
Shock and forksprings ordered, definately recommend RAM suspension. Google RAM suspension.
Super helpful with advice and very fast turn around. Also if your out side the UK they are able to knock off the VAT tax (20% !!!) so worked well for me, an expat kiwi working in France!
Thanks as well 'old racer' Ben, for your email a while back. Would have got the suspension from you, but decided to go direct to RAM as I was after some shock length adjustment. Will certainly keep in touch though as the build progresses. Good write up in the new 'Classic Racer' mag by the way - plus a few other action pics scattered about the magazine :2thumbup:
Just a couple of quick questions; Ben, when you ran the K100rs / K1100 forks with the RAM springs, what oil weight and level did you run?
Anyone else, have any of you tried replacing the std coils with stick coils as fitted to newer sports bikes?
Thanks for the help so far guys. I'll be back in NZ with my pile of ebay bits for my bike soon... :lol:
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Hi, glad to hear its going well. Lets see some pics when you get a chance. I used 15wt oil with 450cc in each leg, dropped the yokes 18mm. They worked very well on the track, until they banned them (the cut off date is 1985 for BEARS UK) and i had to fit K100 forks, which need more like 30wt oil!
A few of the other guys using K100 forks have maxton or racetec internals but you can kiss goodbye to £600.
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OK,
all the goodies are on the way to NZ in a big wooden box, the bike is waiting for me in a friends garage, also on the other side of the world.
I'm sort of in limbo now, not much to do but think about the project and study the over-complicated wiring diagrams for what and how to remove...
Anyway here's the starting point, (not sure if its a he or a she yet!)
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Right then....
Back in nz, back to work sadly, and trying to find time to get the project started!
Finally picked up the bike and got to stripping down the outer layers to see what lies beneath ...
Initial impressions weren't to good, with a little more damage and decay than I was first expecting, luckily it seems to be limited to cosmetic stuff and most of the obvious signs of a clocked high mileage bike are missing. The foot peg rubbers, handgrips, frame paint, and seat all seem to back up the indicated 25,000 or so km on the odo. So happy there.
Sadly the brakes are non existent after sitting a while I guess the calipers are seized up solid so a big clean and strip job there...
Good to be back into it though and I'll try to keep this thread up to date as the build progresses.
But for now here's some pics after the first hour...
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Nice project...mine is not aimed at the track,but for a stripped-naked look.I will also want to remove the airbox to see more engine.Thanks to Duck I now have the adapter to do that.But I will 1st get the bike back on the road with orig. airbox to get a baseline to see if I lose any power thru diff.rpms when I go boxless :lol:
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Hey dude! I'm in NZ too and very interested in this build, keep up the good work :)
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Well the weekends here and I'll hopefully get a few more hours on the project... Hopefully! Good to see another kiwi on here. These k bikes have been raced here in nz before and a mate is trying to hook me up with some pics and details. Also I think I saw a photo of one at the gisbourne beach races a few years ago...
Anyhow, don't for get to let us know how that air box removal mod works out. I'm keen for any weight loss and power increase. Might be some issues with air flow sensor though...?
Right roll on the weekend!
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By "issues" of airflow sensor,if you mean fitting a round hose to the square plate on the sensor Duck helped me out on that problem with an adapter that he had laying around.
Ive always wondered if Duck has enough pieces laying around to build another K :giggles
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Ive always wondered if Duck has enough pieces laying around to build another K :giggles
Of course I do and there's another one in the pipeline. My spring project should be completed in a month or two and I'll post some pics when it's finished. :mm
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:lol: :giggles :hehehe :popcorm
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Man, I feel like a fraud. No sooner had I posted up about getting a good lot of work done than both children and then my partner go down with a stomach bug and I didn't even get into the garage at all! Maybe next weekend ....
Be keen to find out the difference in air box vs no air box power wise . And then some more info on the round to square adapter thingy.??
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Be keen to find out the difference in air box vs no air box power wise.
Answer: Zero. Same result if you run the bike with no air filter at all.
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Hey there Duck, I was not expecting an improvement due to air volume of factory air filter. My worry was that I would be restricting , or changing for the worse the air flow,thereby changing my torque curve.
When you had on your bike did you notice any downsides to the K&N set up,other than filter getting dirty faster ?
I would really like to yank that box out of the bike while I have it apart in the garage now vs during riding season.
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1 - From what I understand the OEM filter does a better job and the K&N lets more crud through.
2 - Next, given how hot the engine compartment gets on K bikes, the oil in the K&N is probably going to dry out faster than it does on other vehicles so you'd probably want to service it more often than their recommended interval.
3 - Engines perform better with cooler intake air. The OEM setup pulls air from the front. If you replace the OEM box with a cone then you're going to be pulling in warmer air from the engine compartment, especially on a faired bike.
Those are the reasons I choose to just run my bikes with the OEM filter box setup.
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+1..........and usually some of the oil at the KN filters is drawn into the TB's, and collecting the crud which the KN's let through.
Inge K.
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:2thumbup: :popcorm
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My worry was that I would be restricting , or changing for the worse the air flow,thereby changing my torque curve.
I think the biggest air restriction is the is the intake port on the mass airflow sensor.
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I was planning on setting up a tube to put the filter to the right of the radiator,since there will be no more fairings to worry about.That will give me clean cool air,might even create a ram-jet effect :yes
As for cleaning the filter mor often,its no more work than keeping my twins out of trouble...heck Id relish getting my hands dirty more often if would get out of ear-shot of them yelling at each other (but I do love them so).
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My worry was that I would be restricting , or changing for the worse the air flow,thereby changing my torque curve.
I think the biggest air restriction is the is the intake port on the mass airflow sensor.
Not even a true Mass Airflow Sensor. Just an Air Flow Meter.
I pulled mine out, now that I have the megasquirt, which uses manifold vacuum. I replaced the AFM with an inch long section of PVC pipe, sanded down on the outside to be 60 mm or so, and sanded on the inside to be thinner. Runs really nicely, and based on the manifold vacuum readings, reduced restriction at peak flow (~6000-8000 rpm).
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:yow Great idea for unrestricted flow but Im doing this on the cheap.Only thing Im worried about is loss of power\torque removing the box.I hope by putting the K/N out into the clean cooler air I wont loose anything,I am not expecting to gain anything (except more work cleaning the filter :bmwsmile).
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Hi, almost embarrassed to ask but after figuring out how to get the calipers off (push the pads back in as far as they'll go) I'm a bit stuck at removing the front wheel axle ...?
I think I may just need more force to loosen the Allen head bolt on the left side of the axle? I've undone the axle clamp bolts but is there something else before I break out the impact gun and the blowtorch...?!? Can anyone help a brother out!
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I did not have any trouble with mine,nor did I see any bonding agent on the threads.
Did you try a light tapping with a hammer on the bolt side (and I do mean light),sometimes that frees up corroded threads?
Good luck.
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Once you've loosened the 4 pinch bolts you need to completely remove the 8mm Allen bolt on the left and pull the axle out from the right side.
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Yep, thought I was on the right tracks. Just gonna need a bit more persuasive action! I think the bolt has corroded itself into the axle. Thanks for the help.
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Just needed a good tap with a hammer, and a minute with the blow torch, plus a ring spanner on the Allen key for extra leverage...
Not sure which one was most effective, but a crack was heard and the bolt is loose! Yay!
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I use a 2 foot section of pipe on the Allen wrenches for stiff bolts. I refer to it as "The Persuader." :laugh
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After stealing 30 mins on Sunday to get back to the project I found a problem...
The reason my front wheel spindle was hard to remove was because its bent! Quite an impact to do that I guess, explains the busted lock stop and dented tank though...
Worse to come was the front wheel... I'd already noted the rim damage and was prepared to get that fixed, but the whole wheel looks like a banana when viewed from the front! Eek!
So now looking for a new front wheel and spindle.
91 k100 rs anyone know what other wheels are the same? I guess the k1100, but any R series bikes. A quick look through eBay only uncovered a single overpriced item...
Not a great 30mins of project time! :dunno2:
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A force strong enough to bend the front wheel as much as you say might have done other structural damage further back.
I'd want to be confident a bike is 100% structurally sound before racing it.
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A force strong enough to bend the front wheel as much as you say might have done other structural damage further back.
I'd want to be confident a bike is 100% structurally sound before racing it.
Worth checking, but K bikes have an incredibly strong frame. They aren't brittle either, so they don't crack. Depends how bent the front wheel is. I had a fender bender once, which bent the forks a bit and a lateral runout on the wheel. I asked the frame guy who I have had work done by (who does a lot of BMW work) and he said that K bikes rarely bend without a fairly serious crash.
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I know what you mean about the forces through the bike... All seems good so far but once the motor is out I'll measure it properly.
Only other damage so far is twisted triple trees (easy to fix) busted off steering stop (slightly more tricky but an easy race bike bodge) and a dented tank (who cares!)
Hopefully no more surprises! I'm sure there will be... Its a project after all!
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I have just found this thread and am amazed at what you have bought. I also bought a K100RS 16valve here in France just before Christmas. It was also a wreck with a bent front wheel, no disk pads left at the front, non working ABS, cracks and filler all over the top fairing etc.
I don't intend to do anything special to it apart from bring it back from the dead. This is how it looks now, 12 weeks after buying it.
(http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q259/bikesindordogne/FILE0006.jpg)
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Love the gold rims,and I know the Corbin seat is comfy.That green trim on the seat does not work well with the gold though.
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Anyone out there have a front wheel for my k100rs race bike they want to sell?...
My eBay worldwide searching is only uncovering a lot of 18 rims off older bikes, and I need a replacement 3.5x17 for mine. I don't mind if its in bad condition with seized bearings as long as its straight. I'm willing to pay shipping from anywhere. Did I mention cheap is good! :2thumbup:
Help! :dunno
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Anyone out there have a front wheel for my k100rs race bike they want to sell?...
My eBay worldwide searching is only uncovering a lot of 18 rims off older bikes, and I need a replacement 3.5x17 for mine. I don't mind if its in bad condition with seized bearings as long as its straight. I'm willing to pay shipping from anywhere. Did I mention cheap is good! :2thumbup:
Help! :dunno
You can straighten them.
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Love the gold rims,and I know the Corbin seat is comfy.That green trim on the seat does not work well with the gold though.
I don't like the seat either. I am thinking of getting someone to recover it with new foam and gel inserts, but need to spend the money on things like a couple of brake disks first.
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I know it's been a while, but time for an update...
No pics though sorry, I'll get to those soon - well soonish!
Starting from the back the bike now has the r1150gs wheel fitted and centred, which meant using an r1150 caliper, disc and removing the standard rear disc and caliper so the wheel could move the 10mm or so to the right. The RAM shock is on, patterns made for the new rear sets, and new clip on bars fitted, those bars needed some spacers making to get the clamps from 50 mm down to 41.6, and the controls reaming out to 7/8 instead of 22mm. Also fitted a 1/4 turn throttle ( endless fiddling there! ) front forks have new seals, RAM springs (longer so no spacers needed) and 15wt oil. Got the front wheel straightened and a new front axle replaces the bent original. Oh yeah, and I got a hole in the rocker cover fixed.
Next on the list is, fabricating a set of rear sets, fork bridge, making up brake lines, cutting the rear frame loop, make a bracket to secure the race seat, remove the radiator fan, make a new lock stop (original snapped off), get a new battery, see if it starts, then start hacking into the 100kg of wiring! Still need to get a tacho but gonna wait til the bike is running first. Get a link piece made to take the 4 headers into a Suzuki fitting rear muffler I have. And about a squillion other brackets and tabs to either remove (easy) or make (more tricky!) not to mention the paint,tyres,general service, valve clearances, drive shaft etc, then fuel riding and adjusting!
Phew! Not much then!
I have a YB-9 battery which is much smaller and lighter than the standard one. Anyone know if it'll work. Not running any extras like abs, heated grips, lights, radio's etc so should still start it, but will it run the motronic and efi whilst the bike is running?
Better get to it if its gonna be ready for the Barry sheene memorial race in October...
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Well at least you don't have much more to do... :yow
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I know, it seems a lot when you write it down!
Plus there's there's the stuff I haven't found yet .... :yow
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Starting to look like a real race bike now... :2thumbup:
But that list seems to get longer the more work I do :deal: :yow
Holiday coming up soon for me, but a ski trip with family and friends and a trip to watch the bmx world champs may eat up some project time, so I imagine slow progress - sorry! :dunno2:
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Right today I had a simple task, to stop mucking about with bits and bobs and get it running!
Well, all was good; sparks, check
Compression, check
Fuel, errr dry plugs...
Couldn't hear the fuel pump doing much so decided to get started there...
Ever wondered what petrol with ethanol in does to rubber seals and pipes?
Wonder no more.....
Turns it to sticky black tar it would seem - great! :dunno
Not sure how long the old fuel had been in the tank... 18 months at least, probably 3 years!
Yuk!
Fuel pump dead. Hard wired it up. Not even a click or any movement at all...
Next step, clean it all up, buy new seals and hoses, try pump again - any suggestions? Then buy new pump.
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Decided to strip the solid pump. Pretty easy really. Just prized open the top tabs / corrugated edge a few gentle taps with a mallet and suitable size piece of wood and out she comes. This is where it gets exciting....
Just as I had freed the seized end bearing / bushing we had a 6.5 magnitude earthquake here! Had to run and grab the bike as it was falling over ( now strapped down with ratchet straps )
Quite a bit of damage in Wellington, about 30 miles away, but all ok here. Moved a bit of furniture around though. Biggest quake I've ever felt! :yow
Completion of fuel pump overhaul continues another day!
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Just a quick one. How do you get this gooey ethanol degraded rubber off? My hands are covered and it stains everything. Got to try and have a parts clean up tomorrow .... Suggestions? Brake cleaner or wd-40 don't shift it. My hands took a good scrubbing with swarfega hand cleaner and sugar, but only the scourer and nail brush started to move it.... :yow
Should be fun... :clap:
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greetings gavthirtyseven...
(http://pics.drugstore.com/prodimg/418227/450.jpg)
nuff said...
j o
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Great! I'll get some this morning...
Thanks
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Worked ok - still a pretty stubborn mess. Then a friend suggested I try some of his methanol!!
Jeez, that stuff is potent! it seems to remove it, well better than anything else. Got the last particularly stubborn soaking in some overnight. - outside and well vented!
In other news I got a replacement fuel pump from a bmw320i car from the wreckers today. It came as a large assembly so hope to be able to use some of the extra clips and rubbers to make it fit in the tank. Will post up some pics as it may help someone else...
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:2thumbup:
It works!
Managed to fit the bmw 320i fuel pump in to the tank using a mix of k100 and parts from the cars assembly. A certain amount of dremel trimming was needed, It's not pretty but hey - it works and was cheap!
I was so engrossed during the problem solving, and my hands so covered in ethanol/ tar gloop that I didn't get any pics - sorry!
If anyone really wants to know how I did it, post up here and I'll give a few more details.
Anyway, the best bit of all this is that the bike now runs! :clap:
1st push of the button with a much smaller yb9 battery, just using the dregs of old fuel in the lines and the new pump!
1st time in 2 years - cool! :riding:
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"If anyone really wants to know how I did it, post up here and I'll give a few more details."
Yes please...another useful alternative to the stock pump set-up.
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Hey gavthirtyseven! How's the build going? :D
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looking forward to this beauty!
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Hi all, yep it's going well, but a little slow... The build not the bike!
My original plan was to have it ready for the Barry sheene memorial race weekend, but that's 2 weekends away and err, my bike isn't!
Made a pretty cool fork brace from 12mm thick aluminium plate that allows me to retain the std front mudguard. Fixed the broken off steering lock stop, replaced the ignition switch with a rocker switch on the bars, and the starter is now a simple button and goodbye to the std switch gear. Almost finished the rear sets and new pegs.
Next few jobs will be to decide if I go with a stubby little underseat muffler (tricky to make, may be too loud, but waaaay cool!) or go with a larger side mounted one (simpler, quieter).
Decide whether to run with or without cooling fans and thermostat? My previous race bikes have been no to both but not too sure how hot the k will get... thermostat out and fans on to start with probably?
Get some brake lines made up now the abs system is all gone and I have an rgv 250 rear master cylinder.
Wire in a rev counter off a car. One of those universal 0-10000 rpm with shift light jobs from the car store. Local auto electricians have said it should be no problem.... Too tricky for me!
Make up a bracket for the seat unit, number board/ nose fairing, and a million other jobs I haven't found yet!
Oh yeah - and ride it!
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Hi, our race K runs without a thermostat or fan, it runs at around 70-85 deg during a race and if we are kept waiting before the start the overflow will... well, overflow once it gets to 100 but its no big problem, just water. We end up covering up part of the rad on colder days.
We have 2 engines, one is stock, even has the starter motor, the other has stock cams and valves but head is gas flowed and the
ancillary gears for the alternator and starter are removed. That one is started with a foxley starter. Both have k1100 tbs and use our programable engine managment system, no AFM or stock analog electrics..
Only mechanical failure in 2 seasons racing was worn dogs in the gearbox, and that was a standard box out of a road bike with 40k miles. We have a gear cut device that enables full throttle clutchless gear changes, so it shows how much these boxs and the bike in general can take.
Still finished every race we started, infact we just won the Classic Racer magazine F1 BEARS championship here in the UK on the K100, winning 13 out of the last 15 races.
Good luck.
Ben
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Good going Ben!
Gotta be chuffed with that. I haven't been to your website in a while but will head there straight after this.
Thanks for the advice again, legend. One day I'll order that full ignition set from you, can't quite justify the cost yet!
Those mods sound really cool, especially like the gearbox mod. Any hp figures?
I've got a pic of your race bike on the inside of the lid of my toolbox for inspiration!
My last road racing was in the uk between 1999 and about 2003 moving through the 400 road stocks to super club and MRO 600's and finally to the aprilia Mille cup, sound of thunder and open class racing agAin at MRO and super club. I also used to work as an instructor at the Suzuki race school at Mallory and at the Ron Haslam school, and was an instructor/travelling marshal at the 100% bikes track days for a few years, so maybe our paths have crossed somewhere there!
Since then we've moved to NZ, had two kids, I've gone mx racing for a bit, but it's hard to shake that road racing bug!!
Slow progress with work, family etc, but our summer is coming and guy Martin is also heading over for our Boxing Day street races in wanganui, so there should be enough inspiration with that stuff going on!
I just hope I still fit in my old leathers!